Choosing a CMS over CI?

[eluser]x_dde_x[/eluser]
I've now successfully deployed three small to medium scale websites using CodeIgniter. All three sites have required blog and CMS management aspects.

So basically I wrote a custom CMS system for each site using TinyMCE as the default page editor and custom CI libraries to manage the interactions. The sites all work great, have low load on the system, and are able to serve a lot of people at once. Wonderful, and I totally love CI. I really don't want to code in anything else at the moment.

However here is my conundrum. I have a potential client who has a pre-existing site that they're looking for help with. The site is a basic Drupal integration site, no custom URLs (still using node/123 and taxonomy/123, etc...). And basically it looks like a rats nest that I'm not interested in delving in to.

I downloaded and installed Drupal this morning and have gotten a basic site together, just to see what it's like. Frankly I hate it.

The question I have is twofold, does Drupal have any benefit over a home-grown CI integration. And does CI have any CMS libraries?

[eluser]jedd[/eluser]

I downloaded and installed Drupal this morning and have gotten a basic site together, just to see what it's like. Frankly I hate it.

Perhaps going off-topic, but it will probably help work out the answer to your question(s) .. what do you hate about it?

The question I have is twofold, does Drupal have any benefit over a home-grown CI integration. And does CI have any CMS libraries?

Well, it's positively huge and would take several people several years, even using CI, to come up with comparable functionality. So that's one benefit I'd guess. Second, someone else is writing all the updates.

I think a lot of people write CMS / Wiki style systems with CI (actually most stuff anyone does on the net is pretty much CMS/wiki-ish derivatives) so it's a safe bet to say you'll find some libraries that will help. Have you looked at ExpressionEngine btw?

[eluser]Colin Williams[/eluser]
If a client comes to you and needs a basic site, powered by a CMS, I don't even know why you would turn to CI when there are so many feature-rich and mature PHP-based CMSs.

Drupal is incredibly mature, and is better described as a content management framework. It also follows the main tenant of MVC: Application logic separate from presentation.

CI is a good framework on which to build a CMS, but it's not really a good CMS out-of-the-box. Not at all. The only reason I would write a CMS with CI is if the existing options (like Drupal) are heavier than needed or if its conventions work against unique requirements of the site/application.

[eluser]x_dde_x[/eluser]

Perhaps going off-topic, but it will probably help work out the answer to your question(s) .. what do you hate about it?

That's a good point, I never really enumerated why I was not interested by Drupal. And to be fair, I haven't really given Drupal much of a chance at all.

Here are the points against Drupal. Though I may be wrong

1. Most Drupal sites have a definite "Drupal" look and feel.
2. I'm coming from a database engineering perspective and am irked by any query that I can't control/refine.
(I assume Drupal runs a SELECT * WHERE)
3. I want external files to load only in sections where they're needed. A lot of Drupal sites I've found have very basic pages loading 8 external javascript files and 6 or 7 CSS files. I want pages to be lightweight.
4. I'm not familiar with the code

[eluser]Colin Williams[/eluser]

Most Drupal sites have a definite “Drupal” look and feel.

Drupal's presentation layer is completely separate from the application. There is no design that is off limits with Drupal. A lot of people are lazy about fully implementing a theme, so a lot of Drupal defaults are used instead. This is a fault of developers, not the framework.

Does http://www.mtv.co.uk/ look like a Drupal site? Does http://www.kentuckyderby.com/ look like a Drupal site? Does http://www.beyonceonline.com/ look like a Drupal site? They all are.

I’m coming from a database engineering perspective and am irked by any query that I can’t control/refine.

Sounds like a personal problem. All the sites I listed above are heavily trafficked sites, and they all bear the weight of Drupal with no problem. That said, Drupal has a "db_rewrite_sql" hook, so you can alter core queries before they run if you don't like them. As I said earlier, Drupal is very mature and it's main contributors are top notch, so the framework is very optimized.

I want external files to load only in sections where they’re needed. A lot of Drupal sites I’ve found have very basic pages loading

Drupal has drupal_add_css() and drupal_add_js() functions for this very purpose (among others). Drupal's caching also allows for compacting all assets into one file if you prefer.

I’m not familiar with the code

Unfortunately, there is nothing like CI's user guide for Drupal. But there are dozens of books and numerous resources online.

[eluser]gyo[/eluser]
Yeah, Colin is right: Drupal is very mature, and I know lot of people enjoying it's flexibility.
Anyway I can tell you that I love to understand every single step in my application, and it didn't happen with Drupal.
As already said you can't really compare it with CI which is not a CMS.

Cheers!
gyo

[eluser]Colin Williams[/eluser]

Anyway I can tell you that I love to understand every single step in my application, and it didn’t happen with Drupal.

Let's be honest, though. This is more a function of one's effort to study and learn and not a function of the framework. Drupal actually operates under a set of very easy-to-understand principles. Once these are understood, one can easily infer how a particular process works. It's different with an application framework like CI, where you determine the rules and conventions under which the application operates.

[eluser]gyo[/eluser]
Indeed, it's just my personal experience. The only way to choose is to try...

[eluser]abmcr[/eluser]
[quote author="Colin Williams" date="1236491896"]

I’m not familiar with the code

Unfortunately, there is nothing like CI's user guide for Drupal. But there are dozens of books and numerous resources online.[/quote]
Do you know a valid tutorial on line for Drupal? Thank you in advance.

[eluser]Colin Williams[/eluser]
While not easy to follow and very poorly designed, the Drupal project site (drupal.org) has tons of information. Lullabot (lullabot.com) is a great online resource, too.

But if you're truly serious about learning Drupal, or anything, get a book.