Poll: Have you had any clients ask you about React, Angular, or Vue?
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Is React/Angular/Vue the new Rails?

#1
I've been doing design and development for about 15 years. Things absolutely change. Things are also absolutely hyped up and blown out. Some things that come to mind:
  • Web 2.0
  • CSS3
  • HTML5
  • Responsive web design
  • Ruby on Rails
You'll notice that all of these were legitimate topics during their day, and most of them became the modern default. One of them, Ruby on Rails, was so hyped up that I bought books and made an effort to learn it. I found out quickly that I hated it, and put the books down. Even still, the Ruby on Rails frenzy went on, but look where it is today. Usage stats from Stack Overflow show it has only a 3rd of the professional users that PHP has.

So then recently we see that React, Angular, and not so frequently Vue are being hyped up, and if you listen to the people doing the hyping, PHP is dead. That's hard to imagine, mostly because of WordPress and it powering a huge percentage of websites. I totally get why the Javascript technologies are popular, but it makes me wonder if they'll be the next Ruby on Rails. We all use JavaScript, and I'm assuming that because I use it daily. I'm just not so sure what to think about JS on the server. JS doesn't have anything compared to PHP when it comes to functions and stuff under the hood. (and I shouldn't have to pull in a million packages to make an app functional)

I absolutely want to be able to get any job that has to do with web development or design. So far I haven't had a single customer come to me and ask if I use React, Angular, or Vue. I have had some great jobs by being involved with CodeIgniter, and also had people seek me out because of my PHP skills. Other than my website, I don't advertise, so I'm just getting calls based on clients looking for a dev/designer. What's your experience?
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#2
My clients never asks how I solve a problem. They just state things that they need e.g. responsive, slideshow etc.
So I just learn stuff that I think will help me in my developing skills.

I haven't used any of them (React...). But I have seen a increased usage on big websites.
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#3
Unless you're building a single page app I don't think these frameworks are necessary.
Simpler is always better
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#4
(08-18-2018, 06:43 PM)donpwinston Wrote: Unless you're building a single page app I don't think these frameworks are necessary.

I think the view of the people using these frameworks is that they are for everything. I say that because the tutorials I’ve been through make it seem that way. Vue was actually the only one I could see myself using, but I normally use jquery.
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#5
I have been in this field for 18 years, had just one client ask what would be used to build their project. The only reason they were interested in it was to find out if they need a Window server or Linux.

I have been using jQuery for a long time and was a fan of prototype before this. With both of them, you can add them via CDN and start doing your thing.

I hate the whole composer, CLI, npm and dependencies *for everything* era we are in right now. Yes, sometimes they are necessary and they actually make things a lot easier but not for every little thing! look at Vue tutorials, for example, just about all that I've looked at were jumping onto the npm and were downloading dependencies (100+ files) BEFORE they even did a simple hello world example...we are in a dependency hell and I don't like it.
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#6
(08-18-2018, 11:09 PM)ragingTorch Wrote: I have been in this field for 18 years, had just one client ask what would be used to build their project. The only reason they were interested in it was to find out if they need a Window server or Linux.

I have been using jQuery for a long time and was a fan of prototype before this. With both of them, you can add them via CDN and start doing your thing.

I hate the whole composer, CLI, npm and dependencies *for everything* era we are in right now. Yes, sometimes they are necessary and they actually make things a lot easier but not for every little thing! look at Vue tutorials, for example, just about all that I've looked at were jumping onto the npm and were downloading dependencies (100+ files) BEFORE they even did a simple hello world example...we are in a dependency hell and I don't like it.

Hello World Example:

Create a html file
Code:
<!DOCTYPE html>
<html>
    <head>
        <meta charset="UTF-8">
        <title>Hello World</title>
        <script src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/npm/vue"></script>
    </head>
    <body>
        <div id="app">
          {{ message }}
        </div>
        <script>
            var app = new Vue({
              el: '#app',
              data: {
                message: 'Hello Vue!'
              }
            })
        </script>
    </body>
</html>
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#7
@Paradinight, thank you but I actually made sense of Vue some time ago. My rant is more about how these frameworks are dependent on 3rd party tools which again, require more understanding in their own right before you can use any of them.
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#8
(08-18-2018, 11:59 PM)ragingTorch Wrote: @Paradinight, thank you but I actually made sense of Vue some time ago. My rant is more about how these frameworks are dependent on 3rd party tools which again, require more understanding in their own right before you can use any of them.

That's how the JavaScript world works. We can not change it.
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#9
Vue used to be about the 86k library that it started out with. Now its about the Vue "ecosystem" which of course includes conferences all around the world. Its almost impossible now to find tutorials that are not based on hosting with Node/express.    
Despite that - would highly encourage people to check it out. Unless you love jquery. If you love jquery then there is probably no point. Otherwise Vue (+ Axios) is a very elegant, easy to use library.
I refactored and built some e-commerce apps this year using Vue and Codeigniter. Totally amazing what i was able to accomplish. Radically reduced the server and database calls. Greatly improved the user experience. Its also really fun to code with. I have done some presentations about it at meetups - there are slides here if you want to check it out

* Why Vue is important for the future of PHP
(includes explanation about Components )
https://slides.com/cartalot/why-vue-js#/

* Upgrade a PHP Shipping App with Vue
no code - this is looking at a shipping app before and after refactoring with Vue - showing the difference between the standard database/web page centric work flow vs the many advantages of working in the client browser .
https://slides.com/cartalot/deck-2#/
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#10
I absolutely love vue js and use it in all my projects. It's just too easy to make amazing look apps with it.

When it comes to backend dev, I have done a ton of consulting and I'd say PHP is far from dead. But I will say, Codeigniter (even with 4.0 coming out) is considered legacy and absolutely nobody with even minor tech knowledge is requesting codeigniter be the framework of choice.


But to answer your questions. I've had tons of clients as for 'front end frameworks'. They don't specify which one, they just want one. I don't blame them though, well built apps with a good front end framework are a hell of a lot more maintainable.
Codeigniter is simply one of the tools you need to learn to be a successful developer. Always add more tools to your coding arsenal!
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